FFIM

FFIM is a non-profit organization devoted to promoting and preserving Maine's fisheries
It is currently August 18th, 2018, 7:41 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 9:58 am 
Offline
FFIM Addict

Joined: December 2nd, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 4050
Location: Ellsworth
All........

We seem to have gotten away from technique threads lately, I’ve noticed.

One thing that flyfishers seem to differ on is what knot to use in tying on our flies.

Many guys/gals use the time honored Improved clinch......as it works fine and is butt simple to tie well.

Many others omit the “improved”, and just use a five or six turn clinch knot.

If you’re really “old school” you might well tie your dries on up turned hooks, and use a Turle knot.

Personally........while I’m in a hurry I might use a six turn clinch, my favorite know for tying on my Flies is a Lefty Kreh’s Non Slip mono loop. It allows the fly to swing naturally on the surface film for dries, and really is the proverbial “cat’s ass” for use with streamers.

What’s your preferred method for tying on your Flies?

(He asks as his favorite streams are running at 1500 FPS (should be 400 or less).........15,000 when it should be 2500; or 27,000 when it should be about 5000. Remember when people were complaining about not enough water? :-(

Dave M

_________________
"Fish the West every year. Life is short; and you'll be dead a long time." Chris Hutchins--2009


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 10:26 am 
Offline
FFIM Addict

Joined: December 2nd, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 3565
Location: T3R11
Who you calling old school?? Yes I do use a Turle Knot, have done so for at less 30 years now. Don't like clinch knots at all, don't trust them. Depending on who does the testing the Turle tests stronger than the Improved Clinch and about equal to the regular clinch and, yes, the regular clinch tests stronger than the improved.

And I do use a non-slip loop for streamers and even large nymphs.

However, my advice is to use what you find works best for you.

_________________
You see that dimple way over there? Well I couldn't hit it with a cruise missile.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 12:38 pm 
Offline
FFIM-aholic

Joined: February 14th, 2007, 1:00 am
Posts: 1350
Location: New Hampshire
It brings me great joy to hear the a clinch knot is stronger than the improved. I never adopted the improved, so now I know I haven’t missed out on something.

I am also a big fan of the non slip loop, and I consider it the reason I have so much success on classic streamers, I think it compensates for the lesser action of the materials. I haven’t used it on dries or nymphs though.

One thing I find funny, as I tie on more jig hooks. Muscle memory works great on traditional hooks, I know just where the little triangle will be for my clinch knot. However, as soon as I need to do it with a 90 degree twist for the jigs, I bet it increases the timing my 50%.

Finally, I am not too proud to admit that I have a knot tying tool on my best that helps dramatically when tying on fresh flies at dusk. Don’t judge me.

_________________
"Fishermen...spending their lives in the fields and woods...are often in a more favorable mood for observing her, in the intervals of their pursuits, than philosophers or poets even, who approach her with expectation." - Thoreau


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 2:39 pm 
Offline
FFIMer

Joined: July 21st, 2011, 9:30 pm
Posts: 832
Location: Brunswick
Improved clinch on almost all of my freshwater flies. I will do the non-slip loop on buggars, big stremers, and all of my saltwater flies.

It's funny how much we vary on these little things... I tie my own leaders, and exclusively use blood knots, and I do not know many other people who do it that way. Most everyone else uses double surgeons, which I find to be more of a PITA.

Peter

_________________
"A good game fish is too valuable to be caught only once"
Lee Wulff


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 3:36 pm 
Offline
FFIM Addict

Joined: December 2nd, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 3565
Location: T3R11
I think Dave is a blood knot guy. Of course making all those (potentially failure point) knots in a leader is mind boggling when a furled leader is stronger, better casting and more reliable. :mrgreen:

_________________
You see that dimple way over there? Well I couldn't hit it with a cruise missile.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 6th, 2018, 9:36 pm 
Offline
FFIM-aholic

Joined: February 14th, 2007, 1:00 am
Posts: 1350
Location: New Hampshire
The afore mentioned knot tool that your all silently judging me on makes a breeze out of a surgeons knot. Tapered leaders are cheap and effective.

_________________
"Fishermen...spending their lives in the fields and woods...are often in a more favorable mood for observing her, in the intervals of their pursuits, than philosophers or poets even, who approach her with expectation." - Thoreau


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 6:08 am 
Offline
FFIM Addict
User avatar

Joined: December 4th, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 5299
Location: Near the tying bench
I use a surgeons (or double surgeon?) for leader building. And an Orvis knot for tippet to fly (unless fishing streamers- for which I’ll use a non-slip mono loop knot). I also sometimes use perfection loops and Palomar knots.

_________________
"You never miss the water until the well runs dry" - traditional blues


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 8:22 am 
Offline
FFIM Addict

Joined: December 2nd, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 4050
Location: Ellsworth
dryflie wrote:
I think Dave is a blood knot guy. :mrgreen:



I am a blood knot guy for making my leaders. The leader stays straight using blood knots. If you use double surgeons knots all the way down your leader your leader will corkscrew off to one side. Now I do use a double surgeons knot to tie on the tippets after they get too short, but that’s the only time.

I’m well aware Al likes and uses furled leaders. I tried a few made up by Kat, and just didn’t like them. Perhaps if I fished mainly dries I’d use them.......but my leaders have to be all purpose........for streamers, Nymphs, emergers, and dries. I can tweak my hand tied to do that.

But....
.to each their own. I’ll never say my Way is the “right” way........it’s just the way I happen to feel works best for me.

Dave M

PS: I used to use an improved clinch.......but virtually never do anymore. The improved actually is weaker than a well tied six turn clinch. The key to all knots, obviously, is “well tied”, lubricanted, and cinched down well.

_________________
"Fish the West every year. Life is short; and you'll be dead a long time." Chris Hutchins--2009


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 8:27 am 
Offline
FFIM-aholic
User avatar

Joined: October 16th, 2006, 12:00 am
Posts: 1379
Location: Harrison
TGIF wrote:

Finally, I am not too proud to admit that I have a knot tying tool on my best that helps dramatically when tying on fresh flies at dusk. Don’t judge me.


Me too. Not just convenient at dusk, but also in cold weather when my fingers are numb.

_________________
"It gets late early out there" - Yogi Berra


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 1:18 pm 
Offline

Joined: December 5th, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 5278
Location: Manchester, ME
I may have :o reached the old age/poor vision point where a knot tying tool is needed. But hate the idea of more stuff.

As for knots—regular clinch, non slip loop for streamers, knotted leaders—blood knot down to 1 x , surgeons for smaller stuff . Perfection loop for mono loop to loops. Albright for backing to line and line to a permanent 12” butt of 30-40 pound mono. Love fly lines with welded loops to avoid the two Albright knots and the permanent butt section.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 3:18 pm 
Offline
FFIM Addict

Joined: December 2nd, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 4050
Location: Ellsworth
Jeff Reardon wrote:
I may have :o reached the old age/poor vision point where a knot tying tool is needed. But hate the idea of more stuff.
. Love fly lines with welded loops to avoid the two Albright knots and the permanent butt section.


It really is interesting how we all go about things differently, even very experienced anglers.

The first thing I do with any flyline that comes with those welded loops on either end is to cut the freaking loops off..........I simply don’t trust them.

As to the Albright......it’s a great knot, but I hate how it cha chunks through the Guides.......so I only use it on 10 wts. And above. I nail knot the backing to the butt end of the flyline, and superglue that knot. I’ve never had that knot come undone. For Tarpon or Giant Trevally certainly the Albright is a more secure knot, but a well tied seven turn nail knot superglued on nine weights and below works just fine.......with no cha chunking through the Guides as your backing flies off the spool. As always.......

Dave M

_________________
"Fish the West every year. Life is short; and you'll be dead a long time." Chris Hutchins--2009


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 5:51 pm 
Offline
FFIM-aholic

Joined: February 14th, 2007, 1:00 am
Posts: 1350
Location: New Hampshire
maineangler wrote:
TGIF wrote:

Finally, I am not too proud to admit that I have a knot tying tool on my best that helps dramatically when tying on fresh flies at dusk. Don’t judge me.


Me too. Not just convenient at dusk, but also in cold weather when my fingers are numb.



I have been “away” too long. I forgot about the cold hands. :shock:

_________________
"Fishermen...spending their lives in the fields and woods...are often in a more favorable mood for observing her, in the intervals of their pursuits, than philosophers or poets even, who approach her with expectation." - Thoreau


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 7th, 2018, 7:20 pm 
Offline

Joined: December 5th, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 5278
Location: Manchester, ME
Dave M wrote:
Jeff Reardon wrote:
I may have :o reached the old age/poor vision point where a knot tying tool is needed. But hate the idea of more stuff.
. Love fly lines with welded loops to avoid the two Albright knots and the permanent butt section.


It really is interesting how we all go about things differently, even very experienced anglers.

The first thing I do with any flyline that comes with those welded loops on either end is to cut the freaking loops off..........I simply don’t trust them.

As to the Albright......it’s a great knot, but I hate how it cha chunks through the Guides.......so I only use it on 10 wts. And above. I nail knot the backing to the butt end of the flyline, and superglue that knot. I’ve never had that knot come undone. For Tarpon or Giant Trevally certainly the Albright is a more secure knot, but a well tied seven turn nail knot superglued on nine weights and below works just fine.......with no cha chunking through the Guides as your backing flies off the spool. As always.......

Dave M


Note I said WELDED loop. Not the braided ones with shrink wrap, which do fail, including on the biggest brown I ever landed in Maine. Lost it one afternoon when the stinking loop failed, caught the same fish two days later with my fly still in his snout. He had somehow broken off the rest of the trailing leader


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 8th, 2018, 9:38 am 
Offline
FFIM Addict
User avatar

Joined: December 4th, 2001, 1:00 am
Posts: 5299
Location: Near the tying bench
Jeff Reardon wrote:
Dave M wrote:
Jeff Reardon wrote:
I may have :o reached the old age/poor vision point where a knot tying tool is needed. But hate the idea of more stuff.
. Love fly lines with welded loops to avoid the two Albright knots and the permanent butt section.


It really is interesting how we all go about things differently, even very experienced anglers.

The first thing I do with any flyline that comes with those welded loops on either end is to cut the freaking loops off..........I simply don’t trust them.

As to the Albright......it’s a great knot, but I hate how it cha chunks through the Guides.......so I only use it on 10 wts. And above. I nail knot the backing to the butt end of the flyline, and superglue that knot. I’ve never had that knot come undone. For Tarpon or Giant Trevally certainly the Albright is a more secure knot, but a well tied seven turn nail knot superglued on nine weights and below works just fine.......with no cha chunking through the Guides as your backing flies off the spool. As always.......

Dave M


Note I said WELDED loop. Not the braided ones with shrink wrap, which do fail, including on the biggest brown I ever landed in Maine. Lost it one afternoon when the stinking loop failed, caught the same fish two days later with my fly still in his snout. He had somehow broken off the rest of the trailing leader


I've had the welded loops fail, or at least partially cut through. I don't trust them anymore. I'm still looking for the splice vise that Dave M has so that I can do my own splicing of leader butt material into the fly line. His method flat out works IMO.

_________________
"You never miss the water until the well runs dry" - traditional blues


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Techniques
PostPosted: May 8th, 2018, 10:34 am 
Offline
FFIM-aholic

Joined: May 21st, 2004, 12:00 am
Posts: 1037
Location: Westbrook, ME
I think the factory welded loops fail because many people (not necessarily on here) are not connecting the loops together properly.

_________________
"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new." Albert Einstein


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 24 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group