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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 28th, 2017, 9:05 am 
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Thanks for all the insight on this. Sometimes you read things here that become planted in your fishing brain, and they emerge at the most critical moments.
The lesson I take from here is, regardless of how barbless hooks might effect the set, a fish should be played tight, with confidence, at an angle which MIGHT steer it out of the heaviest flow. I tried steering a large Arkansas (CO) rainbow out of a heavy flow last summer, but that fish was having none of it. It stubbornly held it's line in the deepest and heaviest channel and bulled on downstream. I chased as far as safety would allow, but it was long gone. On the same trip, I also had a hefty brown dragging me down a swollen Animas toward a group of anglers after it ate my EHC, but instead of opting for DaveM s advice and playing through (good call) I planted myself and tried to muscle it back. Gone. Until next time...

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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 28th, 2017, 3:55 pm 
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Rory wrote:
maineangler wrote:
But why do barbed hooks still dominate the fishing (all forms) marketplace, if they don't hold inherent advantage? Word apparently hasn't spread to the wider fishing public that barbless hooks provide a superior set...


At the risk of wading in over my head....

I truly believe that when people are strongly committed to a cause, perceptions change and statements are made in the never ending hope of changing others' behaviors, not necessarily to reflect the raw truth of anything.

Exhibit A for me was the whole Clinton/Monaca debacle that played out. I worked in an office of pretty bright people at the time, Mensa members, etc. To a person, the Democrats in the bunch thought Clinton did nothing wrong (ignoring the real issues of perjury and sexual harrassment), and, to a person, the Republicans all thought he should be hung and removed from office.

Independent thought?
Hardly.



Rabble rouser! 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 29th, 2017, 8:38 am 
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Fish Beadheads Boney? :lol:
btw - CR is up, partially open and running crystal clear. Only a palsy 24" of snow left on the banks and approaches, maybe just a bit more in those deep cuts. See you in a few months?

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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 29th, 2017, 11:53 am 
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maineangler wrote:
Fish Beadheads Boney? :lol:
btw - CR is up, partially open and running crystal clear. Only a palsy 24" of snow left on the banks and approaches, maybe just a bit more in those deep cuts. See you in a few months?


There was some serious carnage on one of the pools I think we may all frequent. From what I saw late in the fall (didn't fish - just walked in to see how LOW the water was), chain saws may be required. LARGE pines came off the upper bank and the lower 1/3 of the pool is almost unfishable. Plenty of other water but that spot has always been money for me :evil: Will be interesting to see what the winter has done to alter it.


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 29th, 2017, 12:23 pm 
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Yeah, one huge one was down last year. Just a matter of time before more come down the way the bank is getting cut. Might be a good project to clear some of that out? Curious if it's blocking fish movement upstream....


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 29th, 2017, 1:13 pm 
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Location: Near the tying bench
I highly recommend leaving the LWD. It builds character, and fish find ways of going around such.

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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 30th, 2017, 8:39 pm 
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There was, I dare say, (2) 40 footers smack dab in the middle of the pool. I am sure fish could get around them when I saw them last, not sure where they rest now. Will go in when the road is passable and take a look, guessing some higher water and ice may have had some impact.


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 30th, 2017, 9:03 pm 
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I don't fish that river, so I don't have a stake in the game.
I do fish a river with a healthy brown population with a deep pool full of fish, and almost impossible to fish because of a large blow down at the head of it. That's why there is still a healthy brown trout population there.


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 31st, 2017, 7:54 am 
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RoundaboutCaddis wrote:
I don't fish that river, so I don't have a stake in the game.
I do fish a river with a healthy brown population with a deep pool full of fish, and almost impossible to fish because of a large blow down at the head of it. That's why there is still a healthy brown trout population there.


Buzz kills - both you and Hunter - can't a guy go play with chainsaws anymore?!? :wink: I get what you're saying and it will be interesting to see what winter did with those 2 trees. There are a couple more trees not far from the same fate. That point in the river has a high (12' above the river?) sandy bank where the river makes a sharp 90 degree turn. If a couple more trees go, and the bank erodes, it's really going to change that part of the river. Pretty cool watching Mother Nature at work!


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 31st, 2017, 10:38 am 
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Salmosebago wrote:
...can't a guy go play with chainsaws anymore?!?


I've got some firewood to cut. You're more than welcome to ride your bike up from Portland and help with the effort. 3 1/2 cords ought to cover it.

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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: March 31st, 2017, 6:50 pm 
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I'm with Hunter--leave the wood. Although he is working against his own interest. If you take it all out, someday someone will pay him to come put it back in for us, employing engineers and Maine loggers who can't sell pulp wood anymore.

Back to the original question. I have no idea if barbless costs me fish, but I'm fishing them anyway.

Side pressure, yes. And you can sometimes convince a fish to swim back towards you out of a heavy current if you are applying side pressure one way, then quickly reverse to the other side and pull from a different direction. Upstream pressure, fish starts to move downstream, then reverse and apply pressure on the other side. Often the fish will change direction and head back upstream.

Tricky to do this without giving enough slack to risk losing the fish, and it only works if the fish is pretty close--maybe 15 yards at most--but it has several times kept a fish that was out in the current and getting close to the pool tailout from going over on me.

Still remember a Little Eddy salmon I hooked in a foam pocket up near the head after wading out on the end of a narrow little ledge and throwing a small emerger with the longest roll cast I could manage. Fish jumped on the hook up, dove under a tongue of fast current, jumped on the far side of pool, then turned and ran downstream, jumped again, and over the lip into the rapids. By far the largest salmonid I have ever been connected to. 7 pounds? 10? It was enormous, and I knew it was hopeless as soon as I saw the take. The last jump was right in front of a wading angler near the tail, and he got a way better look at it than I did. He was wading waist deep, and I swear the fish was over his head at the top of the arc.


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 Post subject: Re: Heavy water hookups
PostPosted: April 1st, 2017, 10:57 am 
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I had a very similar experience to you, Jeff, at the same spot, but not as big a fish. Still, it was by far the biggest landlocked salmon I had hooked and played and I had no prayer as it took off downstream. Fish took a nymph on a long roll cast nearer the head, jumped a couple of times, then made the turn for freedom -- I tried to stop/slow fish as it approached the lip and it was long gone.

My lifetime landing rate on true hogs is probably under 10%. I can picture several of those fish still. The fire engine red cutt bow in the log at my feet in Colorado and me struggling to work it free, the big rainbow jumping right before breaking me off in Wyoming, the aforementioned landlocked salmon jumping at the head of Little E and turning downstream, and the Atlantic Salmon jumping in Newfoundland. All but the Atlantic were likely on 5X and broke off.

On the barbless hooks, I actually think I land more fish with barbless than barbed because I get a better hook set. None of those pigs threw the hook. They all broke me off instead.

Yes, more fish get lost late in the game with barbless than barbed, but I get past the first inning more often with barbless than barbed.


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